Republican candidates fight among themselves in the Extremism Olympics

The Trump clone wars just entered its first televised battle, and the candidate most of the GOP primary field is seeking to beat, and in some cases emulate, was nowhere to be seen. But his presence was certainly felt as his indicted shadow loomed over the stage. A question wasn’t asked about him for the first 60 minutes of the debate, but you could see his impact on every candidate on that stage.

The debate was wide-ranging, covering issues from the economy, abortion, Ukraine, and where they stand on Donald Trump’s indictments. But mainly, the dynamic was among the top polling candidates, Florida Governor Ron DeSantis and biotech entrepreneur Vivek Ramaswamy. From them, we saw a firehose of lies, Trump base pandering, and a competition as to who could be the most authoritarian.

On Wednesday night, eight Republican candidates stood on the Fox News-hosted debate stage in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Here were the participants and where they stand in GOP primary according to the latest FiveThirtyEight national polling averages: DeSantis (15.2%), Ramaswamy (9.7%), former Vice President Mike Pence (4.3%), South Carolina Senator Tim Scott (3.6%), former South Carolina Governor and US ambassador to the UN Nikki Haley (3.4%), former New Jersey Governor Chris Christie (3.3%), former Arkansas Governor Asa Hutchinson (0.7%), and North Dakota Governor Doug Burgum (0.4%).

Donald Trump, who didn’t attend, holds a significant lead at 52.1%. No candidate has lost any party’s nomination with this large a polling lead at this point in the race. Instead of walking onto the debate stage with his challengers, this week, Trump will be doing yet another perp walk into a courthouse. Instead of attending the debate, Trump opted to do an interview with fired Fox News Anchor Tucker Carlson that was posted on Twitter (X). This was Trump’s effort at counter-programming, after resisting a months-long effort by Fox News to get him to attend.

If you tuned in to tonight’s debate, you heard a dark depiction of America that doesn’t reflect the reality we’re existing in. In response to the opening question on Bidenomics, the first words of the debate came from Ron DeSantis, who proclaimed. "America is in decline." GOP candidates discussed the economy while completely ignoring the fact inflation is easing, unemployment remains historically low, and job growth remains strong.

It was here that Vivek Ramaswamy decided to introduce himself. There were no opening statements in this debate, so his Bidenomics answer effectively served as that. Ramaswamy blatantly copied Barack Obama’s famous line, claiming that he’s a "skinny guy with a funny last name." Obama referred to himself as a "skinny kid with a funny name," in his 2004 speech. Ramaswamy discussed his Indian immigrant parents and how he’s lived the American dream. That’s where the Obama similarities end.

Surprisingly, the second question was from a young person asking how the candidates will calm young people’s fears that Republicans don’t care about climate change. DeSantis was first up and deflected. Vivek Ramaswamy falsely, and confidently, said climate change is a hoax.

Vivek Ramaswamy then began to launch into a back-and-forth with several candidates, calling them all "bought and paid for," which solicited boos. He declared some incredibly radical positions. Ramaswamy promised to shut down the FBI and promised to declare war  on "the federal administrative state." Vivek went even further, claiming: "It is not morning in America. We’re living in a dark moment." We’re in a "cold cultural civil war." The top three candidates polling in the GOP primary are total demagogues. That is notable.

Chris Christie responded by saying he’s sick of Ramaswamy, saying that he sounds like ChatGPT, sparking laughs. Mike Pence also repeatedly went after Ramaswamy, seeking to dig into his support. Pence said "Now is not the time for on-the-job training," calling Ramaswamy a rookie.

The questions began to hit some important policy issues. In response to a question on abortion, DeSantis said that he was proud to sign Florida’s six-week abortion ban and falsely fear-mongered about Democrats wanting abortions up until the point of birth. Multiple other candidates pushed that lie. Nikki Haley got more specific, saying she’s unapologetically pro-life, and that it’s good the states are deciding this. She said that federal abortion policy should be based on consensus.

Pence said he would push a federal 15-week abortion ban if he becomes president, and 70% of Americans support it. That is false. The highest I’ve seen that issue poll is in the 40s, and that’s if you include "somewhat support" numbers. "Strongly support" numbers typically around 20%.

These positions are going to run into major backlash in the general election.

It wasn’t until the hour mark that Donald Trump’s name was even brought up by the Fox News moderators, Bret Baier and Martha MacCallum. Of course, the backdrop of the GOP debate was a carousel of Trump’s co-defendants surrendering one-by-one in a Fulton Country Court. The candidates were finally all put on the record live.

The moderators asked if Trump is convicted, would the candidates support him as the GOP nominee? All the candidates aside from Hutchinson and Christie raised their hands. You read that right. Six out of eight people on the debate stage would support a convicted felon for POTUS. When pressed on this, Chris Christie said that we have to stop normalizing this conduct. Christie said that this conduct is below the presidency. He was received by a mix of cheers and boos, but mostly boos. If the truth is spoken on a GOP debate stage to a base that doesn’t want to hear it, does it make a sound?

Vivek Ramaswamy then jumped in, using the attack line that Chris Christie is trying to become an MSNBC contributor. Funnily enough, that attack line was from the publicly released DeSantis Super PAC memo advising DeSantis – which was released to his team’s embarrassment.

Every candidate was then asked if Mike Pence did the right thing on January 6 when he refused to succumb to Donald Trump’s pressure campaign. Ramaswamy didn’t answer. DeSantis deflected and didn’t answer the question either, but when pushed, DeSantis said that Pence did his duty and he has "no beef" with that. All the other candidates agreed Pence did the right thing. Asa Hutchinson went even further, claiming that January 6 morally disqualified Trump from the presidency and that the 14th Amendment could disqualify Trump from office.

Then came another clarifying question.

When asked if they would continue supporting Ukraine, all candidates except DeSantis and Ramaswamy said they would. Ramaswamy said he would not support any more funding for Ukraine whatsoever. DeSantis said that he would make US funding to Ukraine contingent on more European aid (which they are already giving).

Then came a moment that seemed to make a dent in Ramaswamy. Nikki Haley said that his opposition on Ukraine funding chooses a murderer over a pro-American country. Haley then hit Ramaswamy with, "You have no foreign policy experience and it shows." Applause drowned out his response.

The debate then moved over to immigration, crime, and education, which generated mostly unsurprising answers, including DeSantis touting his erosion of education in Florida schools.

The question is, did this debate do anything to chart a path for consolidation around a Trump alternative? It’s not clear. This debate was crucial for DeSantis in particular, who has faced a series of campaign setbacks and shakeups, from his glitchy campaign launch to his embarrassingly awkward attempts at retail politics.

The debate overall didn’t paint anyone in a favorable light to a general election audience, but it may have introduced candidates like Ramaswamy to the wider GOP base. I’m interested in seeing where his poll numbers stand in comparison to DeSantis after this debate.

Vivek Ramaswamy clearly tried his best to pull a Trump in 2015. Ramaswamy was the loudest, most combative, and tried to be as inflammatory as possible to appeal to the worst among the GOP base. Vivek Ramaswamy battled Ron DeSantis in the Extremism Olympics. The question is, will it matter?

We’ll see if anyone is still talking about this debate after we see Donald Trump’s mug shot on Thursday.