Liberal Democrat Conference: Interview: Charles Kennedy: `I am still ambitious so I wouldn't rule out standing to succeed Paddy'

CHARLES KENNEDY has his sights on the leadership of the Liberal Democrats.

He is prepared to bide his time, accepting that Paddy Ashdown is the party's strongest electoral asset. But after the general election, his hat will be in the ring. "I am ambitious for the cause and ambitious for politics. I would not rule anything out, and anything in," he said.

Mr Kennedy, the party's agriculture spokesman, said there would be no attempt to oust Mr Ashdown before the election, despite some disquiet in the party ranks over the leader's abandonment of "equidistance" from the two main parties.

David Steel in The Independent last week said any deal with Labour should be off, unless there was full-blown PR.

But Mr Kennedy said: "It seems to me that if you look at where the party started and where it got to now, and Paddy's ratings compared with Hague's, it would be sheer madness to consider replacing the leader in this Parliament. He should enjoy the fruits of his hard work, and in terms of leadership status, Mr Ashdown's ratings are four or five times more positive than Mr Hague's. For a third party, that is an asset not to be thrown away."

After the election, he would stand for the leadership? "Yes," he said. "I would not rule it out."

He supported Mr Ashdown's abandonment of equidistance between Labour and the Tories, in favour of the policy of "constructive opposition" to the Government. "We have got to be cautious ... but I think we are sufficiently cautious."

Nevertheless, the differences with Mr Ashdown could become a chasm, depending on how Mr Ashdown plays the report of the Jenkins commission on proportional representation.

"It strikes me that we are correct to be pursuing constructive opposition with Labour and co-operation on constitutional reform. That is obviously delivering goods and is worthwhile.

"We want to maintain that. But I don't think that is at all incompatible with also keeping a wary eye on what is going on with the Tories."

He listed two reasons for focusing on the Tories. First, if there was any way back for them as a credible national political force, they would have to take the fight to the Liberal Democrats to win back seats, and second, now that William Hague has decided on the internal referendum on the euro - "the first serious mistake of Hague's leadership", it would deepen, not heal, wounds in the Tory party.

"I think the position has developed in the last fortnight with this referendum decision, and given that Clarke and Heseltine are not going to come to heel, the Tories are going to be divided over Europe over the remainder of the Parliament. That gives us an opportunity to make progress at their expense."

Peter Mandelson, Secretary of State for Trade and Industry, has little time for Mr Kennedy's approach. He accuses the Liberal Democrats of playing teenage politics, attacking Labour when it suits them, while at the same time serving on the joint cabinet committee on the constitution. But Mr Kennedy is not troubled by this criticism: "There are differences of emphasis between us," he said, relaxing on the terrace of the Commons.

"We are not left of Labour and I certainly agree with that; there is no future for us posing as more left than Labour. But we are ahead of them.

"I think that is liable to be a more attractive formula with a lot of those potentially avail- able, disaffected Conservative voters.'

Like a number of Liberal Democrat MPs, he does not support the policy - to be the subject of a crucial vote at this week's conference - to remove education from local government, where the Liberal Democrats have many councillors.

"In the Scottish education perspective, that would not have many takers. It is controversial and I am sure that the senior councillors and chairmen of education committees will have plenty to say about it.

"I think that we are correct to focus more on the quality of outcome that is to be achieved in state provision, and not solely input with tax. We are right to be thinking fairly liberated thoughts. I am not entirely sure myself on this one that the party will go down this route. My hunch is that it won't do. The platform could get defeated."